Hi, I have been contracted to replace a series of old/failing Foscam cameras in a Blue Iris environment.

The environment uses WIFI but does not have Internet. Also does not have cell service. So I need to recommend a list of reasonably priced cameras that can work with the following specs:

Must work with existing BI 4.x (but they've shown Interest in upgrading if necessary).
Indoor WiFi either 2ghz or 5ghz
720p minimum
Fixed view, but PTZ is OK if prices are equal
Configurable without Internet, this site does not have Internet or cell service, neither the camera nor app must REQUIRE Internet to function or for setup.
Does not need night vision
Does not need a speaker but does need to record sound.
Room temperature indoor dry environment.
DHCP for initial setup OK but must be able to be assigned a Static IP to survive power blinks if possible.
Cost will be a major deciding factor.

Trying to avoid the Foscam because their reputation here is not good, they fail often and the enclosure outer surface is tacky and sticky and although their price is right we are looking to see if there are more modern comparably priced and maybe more reliable options.

Most of the cameras I have seen/tested are able to work without Internet, but their APP often requires Internet at camera setup. Eufy E220 is one example, the app installs and launches but my cell phone does not have service and their app will not continue with setup even though I pre-registered the app off site. I am unable to determine if the camera can work without Internet because initial setup is impossible on site.

If anyone who has a camera that fits this description could chime in and let me know make/model so I can research it I'd really appreciate it.

EDIT: I was able to use a very weak hotspot on the Eufy app on my phone which allows the app to now function and configure the camera, but not only does the APP need to reach the Internet, the Camera ALSO needs to reach the Internet for setup...? Using the app, I see the camera join the corporate wifi network and DHCP, but since the camera itself can't phone home the app states that "the camera failed to connect to the server". I suspect this is the new norm and maybe there are no modern low cost cameras that work without Internet, probably for tracking revenue.

I am very capable at installing so even complex setup is OK as long as they can be configured to work with BI without actual Internet.

I plan on buying a few for initial testing and will then likely standardize on something other than Foscam.

THANK YOU.

The first camera I am going to test is the Amcrest IP2M-841B which I see on other web sites works great with Blue Iris and apparently doesn't need Internet or web app to set up.

Anyone have additional ones I can research?

Thank you.

Your question raises so many further questions that it is overwhelming. This is further complicated by who makes what, as I'm fairly sure at least some of the Amcrest range are re-branded Foscam devices.

BI4 should work with most Onvif IP cameras, but if you are increasing the resolution of a lot of cameras, you will probably need a beefier cpu and larger hard drives. One of the big cpu load reducers in BI5 is using sub-streams to identify motion, whereas BI4 uses the main stream. The other cpu load reducer is direct to disk recording.

I would advise you not to use Reolink cameras, as they generally don't play well with BI5, but my favoured cameras are Dahua. No they don't give them to me, it's just that they work well with BI5

Thank you for the reply.

I will try to determine if the Amcrest are rebranded Foscams, thank you for that information. I'll also check out the Dahua too.. appreciate that.

EDIT: found a few references that Amcrest is indeed related to Foscam. Amcrest is out.

If anyone else is using a reliable lower-end camera that can install/run without Internet I'd appreciate knowing.

I guess I am just a bit frustrated that basically every single camera I research around the $50-$75 price range REQUIRES Internet, and am somewhat embarrassed from buying this Eufy thinking as long as it's RTSP I'll get it working with BI and no Internet (I cannot), and basically every other camera I research is the same.

Happy to answer any question you may have... The requirements are about as basic as you can get. I do not need to increase the resolution of the cameras, just replace these that seem to be breaking on a regular basis because of their age (maybe 5 years old?) There are around 10 cameras. Nothing special, just low res and very simple motion detection and saving of clips.

I too stumbled across the Onvif standard which I have not read yet. I am hopeful that Onvif compliance means setup without Internet is ensured. Still googling that.

Basically was hoping users would throw out some makes/models of cameras they know would work here.

Thanks again.

Another Dahua user and I’ve never really tried any others so the least expert you can find

Dahua do a range of cams so maybe have a look at their range?

Many users are chasing mega pixels, so enquiring on 720p cameras is not likely to get many responses in 2023. You will still be able to get 2MP cameras (1080p) with adjustable main and sub-stream resolutions, and they can go quite low.

Onvif or a RTSP feed should mean no internet is required during setup, and you should be able to test this elsewhere by logging into the cameras default IP address with a web browser rather than an app. Any camera with a specific app is likely to make you need an internet connection; I think the Amcrest ASH series are guilty of this, and I'm not sure about Eufy. You MAY need BI5 if the BI4 installation doesn't have the stream parameters for the newer cameras, but then you may be able to simply write them in.

I'm guessing there are some miscommunications with respect to requiring internet. More likely there require an IP Network and a LAN sans WAN would be OK.

GaryBlanston wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 5:34 pm
EDIT: found a few references that Amcrest is indeed related to Foscam. Amcrest is out.

Basically was hoping users would throw out some makes/models of cameras they know would work here.

Amcrest is basically OEM Dahua domestically (USA) and has very little to do with Foscam these days other than evolving from Foscam USA some years ago to become Amcrest. They offer a variety of relatively high quality reliable products that would be perfectly suitable for your purpose..., which out of curiosity, is?

The isolotion requirement of the camera system from any network whatsoever obviously begs the question above. If isolation is an actual requirement for security reasons there are certainly other more suitable options than Blue Iris..., unless of course Blue Iris will be (or already is) an integrated system controller (or responding to one) on a larger production network, or both. Otherwise, a combination DVR/NVR (XVR) may also be a solution to consider. I happen to have two such Amcrest units integrated into my Blue Iris server / network for use with both legacy and modern analog cameras as a matter of economy and flexibility. They will also accomodate a variety of IP cameras from Reolink to Wyze if you understand how to effectively utilize the feature and available bandwidth of the units themselves. No outside network required and it doesn't get much more secure than old school analog, but we are talking wired. And before anyone scoffs at analog, the technology is still evolving and is still quite economical to implement. Given a capable enough DVR/NVR combination, 4K/8MP is perfectly achievable at 20fps and Amcrest makes a very nice example of both 4K DVR and 4K analog camera.

But back on track...

I would exlpore the Amcrest IP product line further. The 841B may be just the ticket -- or close. The IP*M is their standalone ONVIF prosumer/professional line. Their consumer line is Amcrest Smart Home which relies on everything you don't want in a professional network in order to function within their ASH ecosystem. That said, their ASH stuff can be integrated with third party platforms (BI included) after initially being setup by their Smart Home software and some creativity. The ASH21B may be worth a look as a super economical 2.4gHz option as well. There's also the ASH41 with an enhanced feature set if you haven't run across both already.
https://www.amazon.com/Amcrest-Monitor- ... D_BwE&th=1

Then there's the WyzeCam v.3 incorporating the wz_mini_hack if you are a bit adventurous. It all runs from a mini SD card with no modification at all to the camera firmware. Easy to detach from the Wyze ecosystem (after being registered) as a standalone RTSP device and works great with Blue Iris. I use several with great results for their intended purposes. Amazing night time performance. Easy to add an external antenna for greatly enhanced 2.4gHz performance, but also work fairly well with the internal antenna in a fairly clean RF space. (They can also be used as POE/USB/ETH devices with an appropriate micro USB to ethernet adapter.)

If POE may be an option somewhere down the road, this is a reasonably priced basic workhorse as an example. I have one. Rock solid. Nice image and video. Reasonable (above average) night time performance. A very good value. https://www.amazon.com/Amcrest-Security ... D_BwE&th=1

There are obviously other vendors out there worth a look. 5gHz may be a stretch within the indicated budget considerations, but 2.4 can be very, very crowded and unreliable..., especially mesh systems. If that's what's in place, you may want to also consider an exclusive 2.4 network and/or channel (or channels) for wi-fi access point camera operatiions. Many will tell you to never use wi-fi in a serious surveillance environment. I'm not one of them and successfully use both 2.4gHz and 5gHz on my network with equal reliability as the wired network. You just need to know how and not have unrealistic expectations of 'plug and play' in a crowded RF environment.

Sorry for the length and ramble. I didn't get out much today. LOL

These little guys are ONVIF compliant RTSP bargains at around $25 this weekend and don't require internet access once configured for their permanent ennvironment. 2.4g only, but for the price and features still an incredible value. There is also a PT version, though reportedly a challenge to get the PT features working smoothly via BI.

https://www.amazon.com/indoor-pet-wifi- ... TLP25&th=1

The key to something like this or any of the cheaper proprietary solutions trying to sell value added cloud services (with the associated reliance) is to simply register them accordingly, get them up on the local wi-fi network SSID and dhcp server by whatever app is provided, set an IP reservation in the dhcp server/router for the MAC address of the device and install them anywhere not having 'phone home' capability -- provided they're ONVIF devices and can tread water without a life jacket.

You then have a standalone ONVIF bargain that can be easily integrated with Blue Iris.

edit: The first link was for the PT version. This one is for the C110 that I was initially referring to. $37 for a pair of em! LOL Simply amazing.

https://www.amazon.com/smart-indoor-sec ... r=8-3&th=1

Wow thank you ALL for all the information, it is greatly appreciated.

In a bit of a rush at the moment because I'm going to order 3 different cameras now based on the above information to get today's Cyber Monday pricing.

I will update soon, but I really appreciate the information. It is HUGELY helpful!

I promise to update once I get some progress.